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Xiaomi vs Huawei and other budget brands
#21
(01-29-2021, 07:59 AM)Honey Wrote:  Precisely my point, the trade ban was USA showing domination to China however in the long term It has forced China to prepare itself for such bans in the future and prepare themselves to have alternates of everything that is based in USA. Ultimately It will benefit them when they've fully prepared alternates of all things.

I beleive the new administration by Biden has agreed to review the Huawei ban, however I doubt he'll remove it now. (especially because he'll need to consult with allies). Huawei has still yet to recover from the ban however, due to Google's Domination in Android, many users are reluctant to switch to other services, especially due to lack of trust in Chinese built software. Majority are still content to go with other chinese brands like Xiaomi/OPPO (rightfully so), because of the lack of google services in Huawei.

I think after the Huawei ban It is clear that until Huawei's ban is lifted, Its not suitable to purchase Huawei right now especially if you're extra reliant on Google Services (most of us are nowadays), Xiaomi is the number one brand I'd recommend as they provide the best bang for the buck imo

No doubt Biden is going to try to be "not Trump" in some of his decisions, like trying to make a point how bad Trump was and how much better Biden's decisions are.  But with Huawei Huawei was in breach of Government legislation that has to do with the ban of trade with Iran. Then when they started to investigate a can of worms started to open up with some of the dealings that were illegal including his daughter. She was arrested in Canada in 2018 - probably out by now as she was assisted by a very large team of lawyers of the most expensive and best there were - but her illegal and fraudulent dealings with banks landed her in trouble. It's going to be very tricky to remove the ban though with everything that came out about their dealings that broke the laws. And who knows, maybe after everything that went down, Huawei may not want to dance to Google's tunes any longer.  They're now comfortable with their own and their users too. What I can see however is that maybe they'll create a different product by a different company for launching in the US if the US lifts its ban.  And we'll never really know it's a "recreated Huawei for US".

Huawei is doing very well in South Africa presently.  It's one of the leading and affordable quality products. When I was in Canada, it was the same there too.  They make a really good product that is affordable for most. Xiaomi is also starting to make headways too as it is a quality product.  The present South African Government seems to be very cozy with China Government and not so cozy with the US.  Possibly one will find this to be the case too with a few other African countries, as Africa is being invaded with China trade.  Like a neo-colonialization by China. Hopefully Biden will be more positive in trying to improve relationships in Africa, as Trump was openly critical of Africa and created bad diplomacy for the US in Africa.
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#22
(01-29-2021, 09:43 AM)deanhills Wrote:  No doubt Biden is going to try to be "not Trump" in some of his decisions, like trying to make a point how bad Trump was and how much better Biden's decisions are.  But with Huawei Huawei was in breach of Government legislation that has to do with the ban of trade with Iran. Then when they started to investigate a can of worms started to open up with some of the dealings that were illegal including his daughter. She was arrested in Canada in 2018 - probably out by now as she was assisted by a very large team of lawyers of the most expensive and best there were - but her illegal and fraudulent dealings with banks landed her in trouble. It's going to be very tricky to remove the ban though with everything that came out about their dealings that broke the laws. And who knows, maybe after everything that went down, Huawei may not want to dance to Google's tunes any longer.  They're now comfortable with their own and their users too. What I can see however is that maybe they'll create a different product by a different company for launching in the US if the US lifts its ban.  And we'll never really know it's a "recreated Huawei for US".

Huawei is doing very well in South Africa presently.  It's one of the leading and affordable quality products. When I was in Canada, it was the same there too.  They make a really good product that is affordable for most. Xiaomi is also starting to make headways too as it is a quality product.  The present South African Government seems to be very cozy with China Government and not so cozy with the US.  Possibly one will find this to be the case too with a few other African countries, as Africa is being invaded with China trade.  Like a neo-colonialization by China. Hopefully Biden will be more positive in trying to improve relationships in Africa, as Trump was openly critical of Africa and created bad diplomacy for the US in Africa.


Hmm I see, well Huawei(Especially Huawei's sub-company Honor)  was very popular here(Pakistan) before the ban, and was preferred due to their good performance for the cost. However, after the ban only the older models (with Android) are still preferred..

Are the people in SA/CA really comfortable without Play Store? I mean there must be only a limited number of applications in Huawei's store. I heard recently that Huawei has decided to sell Honor to a USA Firm, which is a sign I guess that the company is loosing their foothold...
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#23
(01-29-2021, 01:06 PM)Honey Wrote:  Hmm I see, well Huawei(Especially Huawei's sub-company Honor)  was very popular here(Pakistan) before the ban, and was preferred due to their good performance for the cost. However, after the ban only the older models (with Android) are still preferred..

Are the people in SA/CA really comfortable without Play Store? I mean there must be only a limited number of applications in Huawei's store. I heard recently that Huawei has decided to sell Honor to a USA Firm, which is a sign I guess that the company is loosing their foothold...

I don't think Huawei going to the phone market just like that. Yes, they will have setbacks and profit losses for a while. But they will find ways to get back on the market. Yes, Their own App store is still small there will be more and more apps in that. Also, their phones are not bad at all.

Another thing is in the last few years there is a competition between Huawei and Xiaomi for the Asian phone market. Especially for quality budget phones. Huawei had been on top of the market for a long time and they even start increasing phone prices slowly. Xiaomi has started released phones with near the same specs for a cheaper price. I research the latest phone of these 2 brands for months last year. I noticed for every Huawei phone model there is a Xiaomi phone which is either cheaper or with better specs or both.


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#24
I think you can't believe on chinese brands... the chinese market is just fraud after fraud. Brands? Everything in China is just Oppo or Huawei.

OnePlus, PocoPhone, Xiaomi, Honor are just rebrand of Oppo or Huawei phones. But what you get from this rebrand? A less tested software. Look at PocoPhone F2, OnePlus 7 and one of the top tier of Oppo... THEY ARE THE SAME but with different Android flavors, rispectly: AOSP-similar, Oxygen OS, ColorOS.

If you want to buy a "from-China" device, buy a major brand one such as Oppo or Huawei, you will have a better after market experience.
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#25
(01-29-2021, 10:50 PM)LightDestory Wrote:  I think you can't believe on chinese brands... the chinese market is just fraud after fraud. Brands? Everything in China is just Oppo or Huawei.

OnePlus, PocoPhone, Xiaomi, Honor are just rebrand of Oppo or Huawei phones. But what you get from this rebrand? A less tested software. Look at PocoPhone F2, OnePlus 7 and one of the top tier of Oppo... THEY ARE THE SAME but with different Android flavors, rispectly: AOSP-similar, Oxygen OS, ColorOS.

If you want to buy a "from-China" device, buy a major brand one such as Oppo or Huawei, you will have a better after market experience.

5 years ago I would totally agree with you. That's why I went for an older flagship Samsung phone for the price of a brand new Huawei phone. But since then I have seen things changing a lot. That those times only good Huawei phones were those their top tire models. I wouldn't even consider Xiaomi. But then I get to find out a lot about these since some of my friends bought phones from both these brands. They have been quite happy with their performance. Also, I have been using Xiaomi Remid 9 since last August and I'm seriously impressed with it. I would say these phones are better than the Samsung budget models you get for the same price.

I don't know about other brands but I think Huawei and Xiaomi are moving toward the quality phone brands, that's if they are already not there. They have already done very well at budget and medium level phone markets. I don't think they are at the same level as Apple and Samsung when it comes to flagship-level phones since these later brands have many new technologies they prefer not to share or sell. Ofc there are plenty of cheap and terrible not so well known Chinese phone brands. But I'm just talking about these 2 brands plus Oppo.


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#26
(01-29-2021, 01:06 PM)Honey Wrote:  Are the people in SA/CA really comfortable without Play Store? I mean there must be only a limited number of applications in Huawei's store. I heard recently that Huawei has decided to sell Honor to a USA Firm, which is a sign I guess that the company is loosing their foothold...
I don't think anybody in South Africa cares that much.  It's the first time I heard of Honor though.  Maybe selling Honor to a company in the US could be like a Trojan Horse to get Huawei up and running in the US again.  Under a different trade name.  I'm just thinking out loud now.  Not sure how Huawei will proceed.

(01-30-2021, 02:45 AM)xdude Wrote:  I don't know about other brands but I think Huawei and Xiaomi are moving toward the quality phone brands, that's if they are already not there. They have already done very well at budget and medium level phone markets. I don't think they are at the same level as Apple and Samsung when it comes to flagship-level phones since these later brands have many new technologies they prefer not to share or sell. Ofc there are plenty of cheap and terrible not so well known Chinese phone brands. But I'm just talking about these 2 brands plus Oppo.

I totally agree.  Definitely in Canada the top models of Huawei are seen as top quality and popular among Android geeks.  Xiaomi is lesser known, but every one is aware of it and taking note of those who are using it for feedback.  Ditto South Africa, although I think South Africa has maybe a longer history of favouring Huawei than Canada.  Canada is a strange country cell phone wise, as the cell phone carriers in Canada are fearful of US competition, so are in essence protected by the Canadian Government.  Up to a couple or more years ago, it was very difficult to buy a phone with a loose SIM, one had to work through the carriers only.  Only way one could get a cell phone that was not networked with a cell phone company, was to get a second hand phone in the back streets of a city that has been worked over by android geeks.  Nowadays though, last 2 to 3 years, it's become a little easie.  They're getting there.  Tongue
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#27
@deanhills @Honey

Oh, I forgot to write this before. I don't think Huawei going to sell Honor to a US company. Remember there is a total blacklist that makes it impossible for any US company to do anything with Huawei let alone buying part of it. Plus I don't think US companies would do it even if it's possible. No way anyone can market such a budget phone brand there especially a Chinese one. Remember we are not talking about those Huawei phones here. just the sub-brand. Plus from what I have seen you can get good second-hand phones or a brand old version of phones for quite cheap there is the USA. That's another reason why cheap low budget phones have a hard time entering that market.


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#28
(01-30-2021, 12:44 PM)xdude Wrote:  @deanhills @Honey

Oh, I forgot to write this before. I don't think Huawei going to sell Honor to a US company. Remember there is a total blacklist that makes it impossible for any US company to do anything with Huawei let alone buying part of it. Plus I don't think US companies would do it even if it's possible. No way anyone can market such a budget phone brand there especially a Chinese one. Remember we are not talking about those Huawei phones here. just the sub-brand. Plus from what I have seen you can get good second-hand phones or a brand old version of phones for quite cheap there is the USA. That's another reason why cheap low budget phones have a hard time entering that market.

Excellent point @xdude. However I still think Huawei will find a backdoor somewhere to do business with the States. I'm almost certain they have been doing it right from the beginning of their ban. Like not directly with the head office company in the US, but maybe a subsidiary in a third world country somewhere. Wheels within wheels within wheels. Tongue
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#29
(01-29-2021, 07:59 AM)Honey Wrote:  Precisely my point, the trade ban was USA showing domination to China however in the long term It has forced China to prepare itself for such bans in the future and prepare themselves to have alternates of everything that is based in USA. Ultimately It will benefit them when they've fully prepared alternates of all things.

I beleive the new administration by Biden has agreed to review the Huawei ban, however I doubt he'll remove it now. (especially because he'll need to consult with allies). Huawei has still yet to recover from the ban however, due to Google's Domination in Android, many users are reluctant to switch to other services, especially due to lack of trust in Chinese built software. Majority are still content to go with other chinese brands like Xiaomi/OPPO (rightfully so), because of the lack of google services in Huawei.

I think after the Huawei ban It is clear that until Huawei's ban is lifted, Its not suitable to purchase Huawei right now especially if you're extra reliant on Google Services (most of us are nowadays), Xiaomi is the number one brand I'd recommend as they provide the best bang for the buck imo

Agreed, President Biden is on top of reviewing some of the bans placed on China and products from their market. I do know that Huawei is working on a new Android alternative called HarmonyOS which sounds like will be the OS that will be stock on their handsets going forward. I think one of the biggest peaks to HarmonyOS is that using a protocol similar to Apple's Universal users will be able to use native Android APKs on the os in what seems to be an emulated mode. Another option I have seen my friends who have Huawei devices in America who have not been able to get updates since the ban was turning to CyanogenMod or I guess now LineageOS.
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#30
(01-30-2021, 02:45 AM)xdude Wrote:  5 years ago I would totally agree with you. That's why I went for an older flagship Samsung phone for the price of a brand new Huawei phone. But since then I have seen things changing a lot. That those times only good Huawei phones were those their top tire models. I wouldn't even consider Xiaomi. But then I get to find out a lot about these since some of my friends bought phones from both these brands. They have been quite happy with their performance. Also, I have been using Xiaomi Remid 9 since last August and I'm seriously impressed with it. I would say these phones are better than the Samsung budget models you get for the same price.

I don't know about other brands but I think Huawei and Xiaomi are moving toward the quality phone brands, that's if they are already not there. They have already done very well at budget and medium level phone markets. I don't think they are at the same level as Apple and Samsung when it comes to flagship-level phones since these later brands have many new technologies they prefer not to share or sell. Ofc there are plenty of cheap and terrible not so well known Chinese phone brands. But I'm just talking about these 2 brands plus Oppo.

You are right saying that nowadays mid-range devices from China have the same quality of known brands... But the things that scaries me is the "post-market" experience. We all know Huawei, Samsung, Sony, Google, Asus, One Plus rollout updates very often for their devices (well lately OnePlus is lacking a bit). 

Does Xiaomi and Oppo releases update on fixed cycle? Does the phone comes in a international version (using a CN firmware is a huge risk for what I can say...)

Moreover what you pays on major brands is the software. Everyone can build a phone with good hardware, I mean Xiaomi can out-source the display from Samsung Display Inc. and the top performance CPU/GPU from Qualcomm, but what can't be out-sourced is software. You can use a AOSP device but it lacks of a lot of features!

For example:
  • Google phones comes with an amazing camera apps... but the hardware is nothing special, all the good stuff comes from post-processing via software.
  • Samsung phones comes with a lot of features that are not available on Android at all, often anticipating new Android releases. For example the restyling with a moder design, the Android-to-Desktop capability, single-audio-source controls!
  • Asus phones, most likely the ROG phones, comes with feature-specific to gaming such as bypass battery on charge while gaming or variable refresh rate of the display
So does the chinese phones offer such features?

Another aspect regarding updates is: how much time does the OEM take to fix a critical bug. Most of major brand are very fast on patching daily-experiece break bugs... 
OnePlus (Oppo under the mask) are still affected by the low voice volume on What's App and it is a very old bug!

Speaking of Huawei, we must wait and see how USA will change the restrictions. Huawei is actually leaving Android in favor of HarmonyOS, a huge ? right now.
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