[tbelldesignco]

@deanhills that sounds like a solid plan, coming from a Mac environment I really liked that there was not 3rd Party bloat and what Apple has to offer all serves a purpose to one extent or another. I just rebuilt my dad’s AlienWare laptop and the amount of bloat it installed with the “required” driver pack was unholy to say the least. I was able to slim it down to just the essentials and remove the stuff he didn’t need, but he is primarily using it for CAD rendering and his machine crashed in the first place because of the Windows 10 supplemental update and the AlienWare bloat.

[deanhills]

@deanhills that sounds like a solid plan, coming from a Mac environment I really liked that there was not 3rd Party bloat and what Apple has to offer all serves a purpose to one extent or another. I just rebuilt my dad’s AlienWare laptop and the amount of bloat it installed with the “required” driver pack was unholy to say the least. I was able to slim it down to just the essentials and remove the stuff he didn’t need, but he is primarily using it for CAD rendering and his machine crashed in the first place because of the Windows 10 supplemental update and the AlienWare bloat.

Thanks for reminding me @tbelldesignco  I'd forgotten about Apple not having as much bloatware. I guess absence of bloatware is key to greater security too. So Windows 10 Enterprise would win in that category too.

[tbelldesignco]

Thanks for reminding me @tbelldesignco  I'd forgotten about Apple not having as much bloatware.  I guess absence of bloatware is key to greater security too.  So Windows 10 Enterprise would win in that category too.

Yeah, when I installed Win 10 Pro on my brother's new build I didn't notice near as much bloat on it and I was a bit shocked to be honest. I might have a key that has yet to be used from when I was a Uni student and I got some goodies like Windows Server 2012 Datacenter and I believe I might have 7 Pro and 10 Pro keys.

[xdude]

@deanhills

I thought about that too but decided otherwise. Windows problem is 2 fold. License and data. Main problem is their leech of user experience data. Now I don't mind that but my problem is they using my precious bandwidth for all that nonstop tweakings. Basically, in a way they are like asking us to pay for them to use our own data for their profits. I don't mind that like I said but not on my bandwidth. Plus their business model is changing. I think they will soon ask for annual subscription for all Windows editions just like many other software do today. After all why take a onetime fee when milk customers forever. And in a way Licenses are depends on how much data we are willing to give them.

Like, Home edition is we give it cheap you will us all data, Pro we will give it for affordable you don't have much choice over data. Enterprise, you pay more and you decide you give us data or not. So regardless you pay for it or not still we end up with this problem and you will have to either let them do whatever they want or fight for it. And Microsoft support is crap, at least to my experience. So personally I'm not gonna pay it anymore.

The real reason why they have given full control over data in Enterprise is they don't want to get into trouble under corporate espionage. So they give companies the choice, Hey by default we take your user experience data but you can't turn it off if you want. So I guess I will start learning how to tame this Windows 10 for my preference. Plus I want to see how it will be after 180 days.

[deanhills]

@deanhills

I thought about that too but decided otherwise. Windows problem is 2 fold. License and data. Main problem is their leech of user experience data. Now I don't mind that but my problem is they using my precious bandwidth for all that  nonstop tweakings. Basically, in a way they are like asking us to pay for them to use our own data for their profits. I don't mind that like I said but not on my bandwidth. Plus their business model is changing. I think they will soon ask for annual subscription for all Windows editions just like many other software do today. After all why take a onetime fee when milk customers forever. And in a way Licenses are depends on how much data we are willing to give them.

I've only learned about the bandwidth issue recently.  The annual license issue I've been worried about for a long time.  Probably time for a radical change away from Microsoft.

Like, Home edition is we give it cheap you will us all data, Pro we will give it for affordable you don't have much choice over data. Enterprise, you pay more and you decide you give us data or not. So regardless you pay for it or not still we end up with this problem and you will have to either let them do whatever they want or fight for it. And Microsoft support is crap, at least to my experience. So personally I'm not gonna pay it anymore.

 That is a great summary and you're so right about how crappy Windows is and even worse Microsoft "support".  The few times I've read through support discussions in Microsoft forums, it's usually an expert from outside who is much better at grasping the issue than a Microsoft support person.  Like their support is like standard copy cat sentences that sometimes doesn't even make any sense. I don't think the support person even understands what they are saying.

This whole experience of mine of the last few weeks of trying out Windows 10 reminded me of the classic narrative of Windows being full of security holes and a huge security risk. Microsoft tries to fix these holes with security updates - the more they try to fix, the more holes appear, so much so that those update packages have become too large for hardware to cope with.  I'd go as far to say that Windows Updates have become equivalent to malware to the extent the updates can interfere with the normal operation of a computer.  For me those updates are much more of a threat than the actual threats against which they have been designed for.  Possibly this whole Windows system is in process of imploding?  I've read many blog articles where the Windows Updates are seen as a major threat.

The real reason why they have given full control over data in Enterprise is they don't want to get into trouble under corporate espionage. So they give companies the choice, Hey by default we take your user experience data but you can't turn it off if you want. So I guess I will start learning how to tame this Windows 10 for my preference. Plus I want to see how it will be after 180 days.

You've hit it on the nail @xdude.  This is the direction I will be moving into too.  Learn how to tame Windows 10.  There is a long journey lying ahead of me with this.  I also want to explore the Linux route. But in the meanwhile my primary computer stays on Windows 7. It feel very much like a safe haven after my recent experience with Windows 10 Professional in an upgrade environment.

[tryp4vps]

...... I don't mind that like I said but not on my bandwidth. Plus their business model is changing. I think they will soon ask for annual subscription for all Windows editions just like many other software do today. After all why take a onetime fee when milk customers forever. And in a way Licenses are depends on how much data we are willing to give them.

Like, Home edition is we give it cheap you will us all data, Pro we will give it for affordable you don't have much choice over data. Enterprise, you pay more and you decide you give us data or not. .....

Very excellent points. I do agree with you especially for the bandwidth problem. And this is the main reason why I have a Windows 10 installation but I have not booted into it for a long time.

Linux distributions like Ubuntu allows me to have full controls on networking and bandwidth etc. So I guess I will never switch back to Windows.

[Mashiro]

Have you already tried to set your ethernet connection as a metered connection in Windows? This will actually even prevent the system mostly from automatically scanning or atleast downloading updates unless you allow it manually. And as far as I know this will also limit other things that might be using bandwidth (including auto download of drivers for devices).

[deanhills]

Very excellent points. I do agree with you especially for the bandwidth problem. And this is the main reason why I have a Windows 10 installation but I have not booted into it for a long time.

Linux distributions like Ubuntu allows me to have full controls on networking and bandwidth etc. So I guess I will never switch back to Windows.

If I may ask @tryp4vps Are you on dual boot then? And if yes, how have you partitioned it percentage wise?

[tryp4vps]

If I may ask @tryp4vps Are you on dual boot then? And if yes, how have you partitioned it percentage wise?

Yes. Actually it should be more than dual boot though. I have installed one Windows 10, one Ubuntu 64-bit and also one Ubuntu 32-bit installation on that PC.

The Windows 10 installation is on a small partition with size of only 100 GB, which occupies just around 3% of the hard disk.

I intentionally made this Windows 10 partition so small. Instead, I have a large FAT32 partition, so that I can use it for storing and sharing files between different OSes on the PC.

[deanhills]

I intentionally made this Windows 10 partition so small. Instead, I have a large FAT32 partition, so that I can use it for storing and sharing files between different OSes on the PC.

Now this really looks like being on top of things rather than them on you.  For sure.  Best of all worlds in direct proportion to what you think works the best for your situation.  

I'm taking a pause before my next attempt to test Windows 10 on my laptop.  This time I want to do a clean install, and see whether I can use my previous upgrade from Windows 7 to 10 digital Product Number .  If that doesn't work, I'll try my Windows 7 Professional Product key.

In the meanwhile I got sidetracted, as I really like my Thinkpad X201 with Windows 7.  After making a Lenovo advanced backup and restore image, and Windows 7 backup and restore image, I got sidetracted with checking out cloning and how it works.  I thought it would be neat that if I wanted to get rid of Windows 10 again, if I could then simply use a clone tool in a few seconds to get back to where I was before.  Took me a while to understand one would then require a large external disk for it, and most clone tutorials use internal disks of similar size to clone the contents of the source disk.  Cloning seems to be particularly useful with guys who are changing to SSD from HDD.  So I'm now even looking at internal 2.5 inch laptop disks and to use a USB to Sata cable along with free software to clone my laptop.  An interesting project in its own right.  Maybe another thread about this later.